yeah if it doesnt run good with the 520cc injectors corrected then i will go with the calum basic then just fine tune it with the safc. but that way the ecu is already programmed for the z32 it should make tuning much easier. Probably not going to be much fine tunning needed with the calum but its always safe to have extra. hahaha

Definately get the Calum to make life easier, and boost more fun. Good luck.

You can upgrade up to 850cc injectors with the S-AFC and the Z32 maf with stock ecu and that its a fact you only need someone that knows how to do it....
jejejjejejeje......

^And its the guys like you I try to tell people about. I can't stand when one person says it can't be done and everyone swares by it. There is only one real way to find out and it looks like you guys in PR have been doing it.:biggthump

Yes with safc you can use any maf or any size of injector you just have to select on the safc the correct in and out value of the hot-wire option and it's done. For example:
I was using: Stock ecu
370cc and stock maf = 5 in and 5 out on the safc (Stock Reference Values)
370cc and z32 maf = 2 in and 5 out on the safc
Sard 850cc and z32 = 2 in and 2 out on the safc
I thought that the IN value is for the maf size and the OUT value is for the injectors size. That is just a values for the maf and injectors then you have to make adjustments to the lo-throttle and the hi-throttle settings. You have to find the in and out values if you have other size of injectors and any other maf.

so just wanted to confirm that a stock ecu programed for 259cc injectors with an safc can correct 520cc injectors. i understand the -50% mark, which will open trick the stock ecu into only opening halfway, which with the 520cc injectors, will make them exactly 260cc. but how does +50% of 259cc, which is 259 + 129. not sure how that comes up as 520cc. im confused, but if u made it work, then that's great. guess what ive been reading on before was wrong.

well the + side of the adjustment isnt as much of a factor. making an addition to fuel will keep the injector open longer than it would normally but it doesnt change the CC rating of the injector. That can never happen. a 256cc injector will always be 256cc. A 520cc injector will always be a 520cc injector. when you take away fuel on the safc say for the 520cc your just making it spray equivelent to a 256cc injector due to being open for half the time it would be with no adjustment.

If you dont make an adjustment the 520cc injector would stay open the same amount of time the 256cc injector would stay open because thats what the ecu is programmed for which would make it run pig rich. But when you are adding fuel to say your 256cc injectors without turbo you can only max that 256cc injector out at some point but it will never be any more higher CC's that what the injector is rated at.

Nice times man! I ran a 13.04@110mph w/ a t25 @12psi on stock 185 14's on a de+t with 175,000 miles(very tired). I am swapping in a jdm on march 1st along with a stronger , gripper pressure plate and hoping to get in the mid to low 12's with the same set-up plus some bc satge 2 cams and drag radials or slicks. I am running the same jwt ecu (370's@ 4bar and a bored se-r maf) that black se-r had when he ran his 12.1, so I am hoping similar results.:fingersx:

t25's FTW!:biggthump

Yeah i love my T25, its instant power even though the power slightly drops off up top it still pulls really hard all the way to the rev limiter. haha.

Yes with safc you can use any maf or any size of injector you just have to select on the safc the correct in and out value of the hot-wire option and it's done. For example:
I was using: Stock ecu
370cc and stock maf = 5 in and 5 out on the safc (Stock Reference Values)
370cc and z32 maf = 2 in and 5 out on the safc
Sard 850cc and z32 = 2 in and 2 out on the safc
I thought that the IN value is for the maf size and the OUT value is for the injectors size. That is just a values for the maf and injectors then you have to make adjustments to the lo-throttle and the hi-throttle settings. You have to find the in and out values if you have other size of injectors and any other maf.

yeah thats a very good point. So in actuallity the safc can correct more than -50%, it wouldnt work the other way around being the stock ecu hotwire is 6 on our cars. If you run out of room on the correction part you can always bring down the out on the hotwire setting. Dropping the out on the hotwire setting will reduce the input to the ecu reducing fuel %.

For example my settings for my in and out are at 2in 6out for my z32 maf. The stock maf is 6 so the safc changes the input from the z32 and adds volatage to it to match what the stock maf would see. If i change my out setting from 6 to 5 the safc wont add as much voltage to the input to the ecu resulting in less fuel.

All you would really have to do is figure out how much of a percentage the change from each hotwire setting is and you can use that to your advantage to take out more fuel, meaning more than 50% more on the 200% range of adjustability. Thus allowing you to use 850cc injectors with a stock maf. I will have to do some calculating to figure out the voltage percentage change on my safc to get some sort of percentage change for each setting

Yeah i love my T25, its instant power even though the power slightly drops off up top it still pulls really hard all the way to the rev limiter. haha.

Cams really help that out even though a lot of people say otherwise. I can say from my experience before and after cams and the difference in the mid range and topend were incredible. I am actually getting some bc stage 2's so I am hoping for some better performance then my s3's did.

yeah thats a very good point. So in actuallity the safc can correct more than -50%, it wouldnt work the other way around being the stock ecu hotwire is 6 on our cars. If you run out of room on the correction part you can always bring down the out on the hotwire setting. Dropping the out on the hotwire setting will reduce the input to the ecu reducing fuel %.

For example my settings for my in and out are at 2in 6out for my z32 maf. The stock maf is 6 so the safc changes the input from the z32 and adds volatage to it to match what the stock maf would see. If i change my out setting from 6 to 5 the safc wont add as much voltage to the input to the ecu resulting in less fuel.

All you would really have to do is figure out how much of a percentage the change from each hotwire setting is and you can use that to your advantage to take out more fuel, meaning more than 50% more on the 200% range of adjustability. Thus allowing you to use 850cc injectors with a stock maf. I will have to do some calculating to figure out the voltage percentage change on my safc to get some sort of percentage change for each setting

If you want to use: Stock ECU and Z32 MAF with diferent injectors
Z32 and stock injectors 2in 6out
" " 370 " 2in 5out
" " 550 " 2in 4out
" " 740 " 2in 3out
" " 850 " 2in 2out
And remember you will always will have to do some other corrections in order to obtain your target AFR on LO throttle and HI throttle but this way you will have plenty of room to tune.....
This apply also on different MAF's Fo example N60 Maf and 550 injectors will be 3in 4out and so on so on....

Guys all this talk about using your SAFC to control injectors that big is just stupid.

The SAFC is good for FINE tuning. Once you start to try to adjust your shit that much with just an SAFC your asking for trouble. THe SAFC Doesnt control timing.

Since when did we ever say anything about timing......The thing is the safc isnt good for just doing fine tuning. I mean my a/f ratio is perfect and holds good right where it is. Im on the stock de ecu running 370cc injectors and i will be putting the 550's in there by the weekend. The thing is my car is consistent. i cant up the boost any more right now with the 370cc injectors due to them being maxed out. Thats the reason for only running 8psi of boost with my current mods. Not to mention cruising i get well over 30mpg easily. and thing is i can adjust that to even better. i leaned it out even more on a highway trip while cruising at 75mph i down tuned it by 10% to where my a/f was at 15.5-16.5 range and got 35mpg. its as simple as that, cant do that with a JWT ecu or Calum right off hand right there in the car as your driving.

I agree however that both ecu's are awsome and consistent also. I love the SAFC because i know what im doing on it. Its simple conversion. Why would you say its crap to try and tune injectors that big when its possible and still have a consistent running vehicle. Its just like having the ecu retuned. There is no inconsistency in the SAFC. its settings dont change. The way the car acts doesnt change once you have it set where it needs to be. Now im not saying that i would even attempt to run 850cc injectors on a stock ecu. i would get the calum and then just fine tune with the safc just because i want to. But the 550cc's should be fine and i will stick with the SAFC on stock ecu unless for some odd reason they wont tune right which i doubt being there are many on here that have done it and have great results and good a/f and making really good power. I dont need to spend the extra 200 bucks to get the calum yet. maybe eventually. but not right now

^^^Nobody said anything about timing. Thats the problem! *Edit 95200 said a little tid bit*

Using a stock ECU with an SAFC and adjusting it for injectors that big is cool if all your doing is drag racing the car. Nobody said you CANT do it. But if your like me and like to hit boost on the Rd and you daily drive the car then you need to atleast get a Calum basic ECU so that you dont have to adjust that much and all your doing is literaly fine tuning.

If you know how the SAFC works then you obviously know that it tricks the ECU and changes the maf signal. When you start changing that maf signal it also starts to change your timing. So youll have super advanced timing in spots where you dont want it to be super advanced and super retarted timing in spots where you dont want it to be. This is why alot of people dont like SAFC's and like to deal with standalones or the Calum Realtimes. That way you can actually control your timing maps accross the board.

The SAFC is cool for fine tuning. But relying on it solely for tuning is half assing it on a daily driver IMHO. wh that said do what you do cause your gonna do it anyway. But I just think that alot of people ignore timing when its a key factor also just like A/F ratios.

thats fine and i understand the timing issue that you mentioned. i agree if the ecu sees less air coming in its going to change timing. But i mean yeah i would say yes for a drag car only the big injectors would be safe to tune on the SAFC alone but thats exactly why i said if i was going with anything bigger than the 550cc injectors i would get the calum because of that factor. That way the timing curve is nice and smooth where you want it to be and not all jumpy. Thats why i said i will have to see after i install these injectors how the engine performs and how much power it makes with the added boost. if i feel it sucks and could be alot better and has trouble running nice and smooth like it is now then im gonna go with the calum but again there are many on here running the safc with 550 injectors on a stock ecu and it runs smooth and made good power. but thats what the safc can correct up to without having to use the maf in and out changes to further take away fuel. That might be a little overboard i agree. So only a couple more days will tell and i will keep an update on how well it runs.

I appreciate your imput Johnny. Makes for an interesting discussion. I will keep it posted on results with the 550's on stock ecu with SAFC

interestingly you keep talking about turning the boost up to 16psi, but in most things i've seen the T25 runs out of efficiency past 14psi. you start to turn the air into whipped mass of heat as opposed to a compressed air charge at that point... in my hypothesis you probably wont make any more power than 14psi.. you'll heat the turbo much faster causing a further drop in VE.. and you'll end up shortening the lifespan of the T25 greatly by doing so.

just my $.02

well i got the injectors in and turned the boost controller all the way down to basicly block the wastegate after tuning it to 8psi. well the turbo itself helf 21psi from 3500-4500rpms then dropped to 16-17 and held there from 4500-6000rpms, then it kept sputtering after that, then every time i would go into boost it would missfire. so i got home checked the plugs and 1-3 were good, really sooty from the tuning process but good, then number 4 i pulled it and what do you know, the tip of the plug was gone and melted away. nice. funny thing is that it was still running on 4 cylinders while cruising, it just didnt want to go into boost. put new plugs in it and turned the boost controler down a bit to see if i could get it to stop sputtering above 6krpms. a/f was holding 10.0-10.5. i have the settings all the way out so ive run out of room. i have a friend with a jwt ecu that he will let me use and im thinking i will get it retuned for my setup to make life easier. I cant get the a/f any leaner up top. It pulls like a madman though but only a little faster than my setup at 8psi due to running way too rich.

plus i think the plug went because of the heat from the turbo running too high of boost. ive never messed with a manual boost controler before so i have to get used to it to find the right setting. I want to set it to where it will spike to 16-17psi and hold 15psi. of course thats gonna drop after 6krpms. but that heat from the turbo was probably the caue of the plug getting melted. Oh well no harm to the motor. motor still runs awsome after the new plugs. lessoned learned, haha

i wont take this opportunity to say i told you so, but i told you so. :)

turn it down to 14psi, keep the DP open, and things should be relatively safe. also, try to make sure the tip of the spark plug is nowhere to be found. it causes hell in motors.