I've been doing alot of research lately on nitrous set ups for use on the VE I'll hopefully have sometime this spring. I want a direct port set up with a progressive controller. I was thinking about running a 100 shot.

My first question is about brand. NOS, NX, Zex, etc. Is anyone any better then the other, or does it come down to personal preference? I have read that the NX solenoids are more durable than some of the others, and definate plus if I plan on using a progressive controller.

I want a system that is safe. I want it to be impossible to over rev the motor on nitrous (short of a mis shift). I want automatic timing retard upon the activation of nitrous. I want the nitrous to be impossible to activate below a preset rpm. Finally, I want the nitrous to be progressive (based on RPM). It would also be pretty cool to have it progressivly controlled based on what gear I'm in as well, but thats not neccesary right now.

So, what kit should I buy...? I've looked at both the NX direct port kit and the NOS one.

The first option to control everything is the JWT Nitrous program. I think it can do most, if not all of what I want. The first issue with that though, is its not for a direct port, and its a dry setup. Do they offer anything that will work with a direct port set up? According to Mike K's super old article on his b14 nitrous set up, JWT was in the process of making coming up with a progressive program too. Did that come out?

My other option would seem to be use a variety of components to accomplish my goals. First off would be a progressive controller like the NX or NOS one. Anyone know what features these have? Can they base nitrous delivery on RPM, and how many different "steps" can I have? Like, can I set it for four different nitrous levels in 4 different rpm ranges?

Next, I guess I'd need some sort if window switch to controll when the nitrous can come on. I assume I can also use it to completely shot off nitrous at the rev limiter? Maybe the progressive controller can do that too, I don't know. Another thing that seems like a good idea would be an MSD 6A with a rev limiter and automatic timing retard.

Yeah, I've got a lot of questions. If you guys could give me any ideas that would be great. TIA!!!

-Mike

I have the progressive controller, and it can do everything you want, it can base the nitrous by gear, and RPM at the same time, and it can be the safest nitrous setups with this system.

About the timing retard, it could be done by the progessive controller, but you will need a "msd 6 digital plus", just because the msd 6A wouldn't work.

good luck!

I've been doing alot of research lately on nitrous set ups for use on the VE I'll hopefully have sometime this spring. I want a direct port set up with a progressive controller. I was thinking about running a 100 shot.

My first question is about brand. NOS, NX, Zex, etc. Is anyone any better then the other, or does it come down to personal preference? I have read that the NX solenoids are more durable than some of the others, and definate plus if I plan on using a progressive controller.

I want a system that is safe. I want it to be impossible to over rev the motor on nitrous (short of a mis shift). I want automatic timing retard upon the activation of nitrous. I want the nitrous to be impossible to activate below a preset rpm. Finally, I want the nitrous to be progressive (based on RPM). It would also be pretty cool to have it progressivly controlled based on what gear I'm in as well, but thats not neccesary right now.

So, what kit should I buy...? I've looked at both the NX direct port kit and the NOS one.

The first option to control everything is the JWT Nitrous program. I think it can do most, if not all of what I want. The first issue with that though, is its not for a direct port, and its a dry setup. Do they offer anything that will work with a direct port set up? According to Mike K's super old article on his b14 nitrous set up, JWT was in the process of making coming up with a progressive program too. Did that come out?

My other option would seem to be use a variety of components to accomplish my goals. First off would be a progressive controller like the NX or NOS one. Anyone know what features these have? Can they base nitrous delivery on RPM, and how many different "steps" can I have? Like, can I set it for four different nitrous levels in 4 different rpm ranges?

Next, I guess I'd need some sort if window switch to controll when the nitrous can come on. I assume I can also use it to completely shot off nitrous at the rev limiter? Maybe the progressive controller can do that too, I don't know. Another thing that seems like a good idea would be an MSD 6A with a rev limiter and automatic timing retard.

Yeah, I've got a lot of questions. If you guys could give me any ideas that would be great. TIA!!!

-Mike

To be honest, I don't know much about nitrous use with the VE. From what I've read (which was a little bit ago mind you), a lot of VE owners weren't sure wether the VE would hold up under a 100 shot or not. If you haven't already, you might want to contact a couple of VE/nitrous users to get their opinions.
Most people will probably tell you to go with either NX or NOS, if you're going direct port. Zex is an ok system, but is usualy better for smaller shot setups.
Like you said, the NX soldnoids aren't as prone to freezing as the NOS solenoids, so that would be something to consider.
Regarding progressive controllers :
I don’t know of any controllers off hand that act as a controller and a window switch simultaneously (although you might want to check out www.msd.com, www.summitracing.com, www.nitrousexpress.com, or www.jcwhitney.com since there may be more products available since I last checked.), so you’ll most likely have to use both a progressive controller and a window switch.
All controllers are slightly different so you’ll have to check them out each individually to see what their parameters are. (i.e. – how many change points they have, exc ……)
You already mentioned picking up an aftermarket ingnition, which will be a necessity if you want your timing to automaticaly retartd when you spray. Another perk will be the fact that you'll be able to keep n/a performance optimum since it will automaticaly advance your timing when you're off the bottle.
You sound like you've got a decent grasp on what you'd need to run a system like this. All that's left to do is some research.
If you have any specific questions just ask away.

http://www.nitrousexpress.com/Pages/Maximizer.htm

After looking around for just a moment I found this. It appears to have everything you're looking for - progressive controller, window switch, gear counter, exc ......
Take a look.

You're welcome. :D

Yeah, I looked into the Maximizer. Look down a thread or two and you'll see my question, and why it possibly might not do everything I want.

-Mike

***edit***

These are the questions you posted in the "Maximizer Thread".

MPG9999 - "I downloaded the program for the maximizer to get a better idea of what it can do. Is there anyway to say, run a 50 shot at 4,000 rpms, 75 at 5,000 rpms, 100 at 6,000, and a 125 at 7,000? Or something like that?"

The process you described above is the purpose of a progressive controller. The base function of this product is to progressively increase the nitrous shot as you increase rpm's, so yes you can run a 50 shot @ 4k and then a 75 shot @ 5k, exc .....

MPG9999 - "Its cool that you can set each gear individually, but it doesnt appear that I can set it based on RPM as well like I want too. You can set a ramp time and start and final percentage, which is nice to have, but doesnt really let me control precisily the parameter that I want to control. I guess my question is, is there anyway to do what I want to do with the NX Maximizer?"

Quote from the NX web site in the link I posted above - "This is the ONLY unit on the market with a built in RPM activated window switch with gear counting capability"It's just saying that you can use the window switch function of this product in each individual gear if you wanted to. (i.e. - spray between 3k and 5k in second gear and then spray between 4k and 8k in third gear). So it is an "RPM activated window switch" that gives you the option to customize your window to each gear.

The Maximizer does appear to have all of the functions that you require for the setup you are looking to run.

Well is that a controll thats not on the program, and only the unit itself? Because as far as I can tell from the program, there is no way to do it. Here is a screen shot:

http://www.photodump.com/direct/mpg9999/max.jpg

You see there that there is an RPM trigger to start the nitrous at, a ramp and delay time, and start and finish nitrous percentage. Nothing there to change the nitrous based on RPM. If you are wondering what happens if you click the rpm tab, that just sets the nitrous rev limiter.

2xSE-R, after reading over that again, I am certain you can't do exactly what I want with the maximzer. And for that matter, im not sure if you can base it soley on RPM's with any controller. I thought as well that their base function was to set nitrous flow based on RPM, but all of them I have seen are either time or throttle position. The Maximizer is basically based on time, but with a whole bunch of safeguards and the ability to set each gear individually.

I also just went and re read the sticky on running alot of nitrous. The guy says "You want to set up you nitrous controller so you don't exceed this torque limit. At 6000rpms a 125 shot would add 125*5252/6000 = 109.4ft-lbs. You're way safe as long as you set the time on the controller to be hitting full nitrous by the time you're at 6000rpm. I use Desktop Dragstrip to help figure out time in each gear so I know how long to set the build time for. Its kind of a guessing game, but just work your way up and input your data as you go to match your real world runs as closely as possible."

It appears that you have to use time, even with the maximizer. It really would be a complete guessing game for me without a program like that to set the ramp time, and it would take an awful lot of runs and datalogging (which fortunatly the maximizer does) to get it right. The other thingthat kind of sucks about it is that the nitrous increase will be linear in each gear no matter what you do. I am really surprised that they dont let you set it based on rpms. It would be a whole lot easier, and it doesnt seem like it would be that difficult for them to make a controller that does that. I wonder if I can get any of my computer science geek friends to help me build something.

-Mike

Ug, after thinking about this some more, the nitrous increase is linear based on time, but the rate your accelerate is not constant. At low rpms its less, and then you accelerate faster as you rev higher. That means that nitrous increases at a greater rate during low rpms, then slows down. I guess your acceleration usually drops off some too, so then it would speed up. The advantage to time I guess is that the power delivery is much more smooth and could possibly help with traction more then something based only on rpm. Why dont they allow you to set a percentage at certain rpms, and then allow you to set a ramp time after each rpm incrimint. That would be sweet. I think im done rambling for tonight...

-Mike

lol - all I know is what I read on the NX site. Like I said before, I could be totaly off base. Shoot the tech support over at NX an e-mail asking them exactly what the maximizer is capable of. :)
It would be false advertising if it wasn't a window switch though, since it says "window switch" in their discription.
If the maximizer dosn't work then you can always just use seperate components to get the same results. Good luck.

Well it is a window switch, but all it sets is what RPM the nitrous starts at. After that its time based.

I'm going to send NX an e-mail and ask them to explain to me exactly how their window switch works.
I was under the impression that the reason it's called a window switch is because you can set your own window in which the nitrous will spray. What made a window switch so great was the fact that you could fool proof your system by setting the start point after you've reached a safe RPM and by setting your end RPM before reaching fuel cut, so you have no chance of blowing your motor.
I just don't know why they'd advertise it as a window switch if you can't set your own end RPM.
E-Mail sent, so i'll just wait for a reply.

I'm going to send NX an e-mail and ask them to explain to me exactly how their window switch works.
I was under the impression that the reason it's called a window switch is because you can set your own window in which the nitrous will spray. What made a window switch so great was the fact that you could fool proof your system by setting the start point after you've reached a safe RPM and by setting your end RPM before reaching fuel cut, so you have no chance of blowing your motor.
I just don't know why they'd advertise it as a window switch if you can't set your own end RPM.
E-Mail sent, so i'll just wait for a reply.

Sorry... What I said in that last post wasnt entirely correct. You set the trigger RPM under the "nitrous" tab. Then the increase in nitrous is time based. You also click on the "rpm" tab, and set an rpm to cut the nitrous off at (redline, or whatever you want). What it doesnt have is anything in between thats based on rpm.

-Mike

I received a reply e-mail from NX today and here's what he had to say .....


Charlie, Yes the Rpm window switch will activate at what ever rpm you chose to set it ( 0 to 10,000 rpm ) and cut off at ( 0 to 10,000 rpm ) If you have any questions, give me a call, 1-888-289-6261

Thank You,
Jon Phillips
NX Sales and Tech


So, he's saying that the start and end points can be set by rpm. :confused: :squint: - when did nitrous become so confusing.

The operation is plain and simple nitrous in a specific gear is activated ramps up from and to a specified "shot" then cuts off . The only difficult part is figuring out how long your in that specific gear, then figuring that out for all 4,5,or 6 gears depending on your gearbox. For ex. and this is just for the sake of argument. You want the nitrous to activate at 3500 in first gear and from the point of activation you want it to ramp up from 25% to 50% within 3seconds but cutoff at 7500 then in second gear activate at 4500 and ramp up from 50% to 75% within 2.5 seconds and cutoff at 7500 and so on. The difficult part is finding out how long your in each gear once you figure that out and input that into your program your gonna have to start all over again because once you add nitrous that time is gonna shorten and so on. I plan on using all of the 2005 season to dial this thing in. Also once its dialed in you cant change anything thats gonna alter rpm tiresize without having to reprogram.

I was just playing around with MPG9999 when I said it was confusing, lol. I get the idea of the product.
It looks like a good product, I look forward to seeing your results. :biggthump