coors75

I currently have a nx2000 with an avenir swap GTiR T28 turbo about ready to go in. However unlike yourself I do not have a lot of track experience and was wondering would it be a severe hindrance to my driver development to jump straight to a turbo NX instead of keeping it NA for another year. ( I have only 4 AutoX and 1 HPDE under my belt). While I have almost everything for the swap I don't want to rush it if it is going to be a stumbling block to my driving development. Then again many people start out with faster cars and seem to do fine.

I would only put the build off for one season so approx 3-5 hpde qnd 6-10 autox. Any longer and i will feel guilt leaving my nice avenir cold and unloved. Ps if i stay na my avenir has a crank scrapper and windage tray i could swap over to keep the engine more reliable.

What would you track junkies recommend? Thanks

Scca_Ev

It won't "hinder" anything to go turbo, but there really isn't a need. "Mo powr" won't make you faster or more consistent if your suspension isn't up to the task, it will only frustrate you more.

If it were I, I would sell the avenir and get some suspension goodies. You would be surprised how fast 150ish HP will push a car when you don't have to slow down so much for the turns

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ciclon1

Suspensión and tiers is the secret to going fast
Gus

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Joelamite

Hello and welcome to the fun!
Not sure where everyone else ran off to... Years ago this RR forum was pretty active.
Bill is 100% correct in my opinion about power. Hey Bill, you racing in Feb?
I purchsed Rosens car and plan on running the full 2012 season.
If you learn to drive a car fast because of momentum and not hp, when you add hp to it, you will be REALLY fast...
Honestly, I would build a forgiving and bullet proof car, worry about you and having fun and not the car... The best car is not the fastest, a car that you only have to worry how much gas you have in it will provide the most fun during HPDE's... Screw the Z06's
The turbo would be plenty of smiles on the track and would also be fine for the first few HPDE's... Its not like your trying to learn to drive in a viper. My opinion anytime you put a heat pump on a car, they greatly increase the potential of issues... But then again, your from some crazy frozen section of the world, No worries of running boost on 125+ deg track temps. The stock NX has plenty of power. If you want the added power go for it. Ultimatly its your car and if a turbo nx is your idea of fun, why let someone else stop you. The track is the best place to enjoy YOUR build and car (edit) in HPDE...

Please make sure no matter what you do, put some good pads and fluid in that thing and overfill the engine with oil.

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Scca_Ev

Feb is likely out as I am trying to sell my house and buy another. Will be at Summit though. Hopefully will run full season in '13... I think I may be fast enough to play with the pack this year, but don't tell the other SER guys.

coors75

Just a note to Scca_Ev I currently have agx/gc sleeves (350f/250r) with gc camber plates, st rear bar (will be buying front and rear progress bars before next spring), and front and rear strut bar (rear is triangulated) es bushings and whiteline castor bushings.

I am also running 205/50/15 rs2 (not the best 140 UQTG tire but reasonable). I also have 14" v700 victos but want to wait to jump to r-comps as I heard they can cover up faults them bite you.

I also have 11.75 fastbrakes kit enroute (with the superlite calipers) which of course won't fit under the 14" wheels for the v700 but that's not a insurmountable obstacle.

Agx and my spring rate are admittedly not ideal but it is a DD so I have to compromise.

Thanks for the advise guys keep any more you have coming and I guess I should point out I am only going for 250-WHP with the turbo build. Cheers

Scca_Ev

Okay, here is where I am.

Experience:Before starting into tracking and racing in a more serious fashion, I did 1-2 track days a year for about 10 years. I am starting my 3rd year as a PDX instructor and racing with NASA. I have had my B14 for 4 years.

My progression in brief:

I started with purchasing a 95 200sx as a showroom stock SCCA race car. It came with AGX's and stock springs, and a ST rear bar. I drove it like that and it pushed REAL bad.

First upgrade was a front and rear progress bar, still pushed. I installed Megan racing coil overs with 425F/350R spring rates. Still pushed. I removed the front bar and the push diminished a good deal, but was still there. Next I installed 550 rear springs, push still there, but was about 20% of what it was when I started. I have raced on this setup for 2 seasons now. I dropped 7 seconds a lap at my home track. I am sure a lot of that was track time, but until the last day of last season I was stuck in the low 1:30's, high 1:29's (summit point main). The fast guys in my class run consistent low 1:28's with a lap or two in the 27's or even 26's. I made some adjustments at the last PDX and got down to a :28.5. Considering my car is about 100lbs over weight I don't think I am doing all that bad.

I had a PDX student that was running the Hyperco's with AGX's. As I mentioned, I had him pull an end link on his front bar and the turn in was like night and day. His setup isn't that far off yours. None of the B13's in my class run with a front bar.

If you want your car to handle well on a road course (FWIW), my suggestion is you swap the front and rear springs, get that progress rear bar and set it to full stiff. It sounds like you have a decent suspension otherwise to get started. Depending on your progression, you will likely start over driving your suspension in 3-5 event days. You then have to make a decision on which direction to go, more power, or better suspension. I suspect your enjoyment will be better if you work on the suspension side of things.

I am no expert like others, but this is my view of where I was, where I am, and where I am going.

Scca_Ev

Oh ya... which one is Rosen's car?

awdracer

The other black one. Joe had it at a couple of events this year before the motor grenaded.

It should be a good car after Joe works out the bugs. He can wrench and he can drive.

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awdracer

Coors, Use the brake package that will allow you to run the street tires. Change the fluid and put a race pad in the front. Keep all of the suspension bits that you have on the car as they are. There's nothing there that will get you in trouble. Put the turbo in the attic.

People have a common misconception. They think that they have to build a fast car to race. The truth is that you have to find a road racing class that has people already in it unless you want to drive around by yourself. Then you have to build a car to a rule set and then go out and drive your car better than the guys that are already there.

Joelamite

Scott Hey man!!! You want to go out and get us some Rockfish one weekend?



Most of the Sentras in the MA run nx brakes and I can guarentee they push the car harder into the breaking zones than you will...
The fastbrakes setup... you may get more hours out of your rotors and pads so thats a plus.. Arn't those superlitea HUGE?
Scott, What does wade have? His are dynalite correct?



Harper had that AGX GC setup for YEARS!!! And they were blown for most of it and he drove the heck out of that car.
Heck they were on that car back in early 2000's 01' 99' whatever when I drove it... I won the NASA PS4 Championship (before the big $$$ PTE days)one of those years with his old car and that setup.. Sure there is better, but don't knock it..


Take his advise if you plan on racing, I didn't, and I'm back where I was 6 years ago... and 6 years behind...
If you just plan on doing HPDE's then turbo it if you want... It would be fun.
I personally would stay away from heat pumps.
But like Scott said, if you plan on ever racing the car, don't do it or be prepared to go back.

coors75

The superlites are supposed to fit under my 15" which have the RS2's. I will hold off the blow dryer for at least one season. I should clarify this is a DD and I am doing HDPE with an eye to Solo1 which locally the spx cl;ass (if I turbo) is less completive than the sp class I would be in without. No wheel to wheel with my DD (no cage on the street for me.) I am looking at a dedicated track car though too.

Thanks guys.

PS re: the no front sway bar. I had heard that only become beneficial to remove if you spring rates are over 500# ? Not saying your wrong just counter to the common conception (not always right by ANY means).

Joelamite

Superlites are super big... I have a set of new ones in the shop for thick rotors and putting them on the sentra never crossed my mind...

Front sway bar.
I could be wrong, but I don't know any (mid atlantic) PTE guys that uses it.
I remember testing that years ago with one end link installed and then removing it with results favoring unhooked.
FWIW, I put a front bar back on harpers car last season after I put in a NASCAR torsion/sway bar for his rear sway bar. I think he ended up unhooking the front end links and going back to no front bar. I have plans to put the same rear bar on my car and not run a front bar.

coors75

I will definitely try the no front bar then!

awdracer

Hi, Joe! I haven't been fishing in about 2 yrs :-). I may have a trip in the works with another guy. I'll let you know. I want to go. One of my friends fishes a lot and he has a boat that has a small cabin around the wheel house that he can enclose with plastic. That way it's not so cold when fishing in Dec/Jan.



I am the only sentra in the MA region with the Fastbrakes upgrade and mine came with dynalite calipers. I also use a solid (not slotted or drilled) rotor. Coors probably has the dynalites as well. I don't think Fastbrakes makes a superlite kit for 15" wheels.

http://www.fastbrakes.com/product_p/...b13%2011-4.htm

I like this setup because I can get brake pads for $15 a set with a 1st place Hawk contingency.

Everyone with the NX setup pays $100+ even with the Hawk contingency. The capital cost of the setup was higher but I've made it up on the cost of pads after 4 yrs racing.

Joelamite

Enclosed wheel house? That must be nice! We freeze
We can use my pops boat anytime.

that fastbrakes setup is nice and paid for on the 8/9th set...
I may look into that if I can get the car out of the cloud of rosens bad luck.
How long do the rotors last?

coors75

The superlite kit is new. I absolutely have the superlite calliper. Bigger pad surface, thicker pad and less flex from the caliper compared to dynalites.

awdracer

The rotors seem to last 3-5 events on a 6 event season. I've never had one fail, warp, or thin out. They just get a lot of surface cracks and I replace them when my tolerance for those cracks reaches its limit. I think the replacement rotors are $80 shipped from Fastbrakes. He uses a 11.5" Brembo that he drills a couple of extra stud holes into so they'll fit.

Joelamite

I personally think the superlite is overkill... I am sure you have a superlite for the thinner .8" rotor, but still those are some big calipers...

Mad props for a big brake setup but A 225mm street tire and 120mph 2500#+ w/driver on superlites... Bigger is better I guess...
the street tire alone can only ask so much out of the brakes....
Much less a hoosier....

Scott the dynalites... are they better than the nx setup performance wise or are they better because you can get more hours out of the pads and rotors?

coors75

Yeah main reason for going with the superlites is they are stiffer and Fastbrakes actually stopped making the 11.75 kit with the dynalites due to not selling any for some time. He still can on request though. IT is overkill but I can play with pad choice to keep the tires and braking in balance.

Any other tips experience any cares to share re the b13 chassis and racing? Has anyone done any basic aero? I am think of a custom longer under tray and possibly a splitter but I have heard with a splitter you need a rear wing to balance the front and rear; there is NO WAY I am putting a wing on my DD FWD!

How many track days do you think someone should have under their belt on street tires before going to R-comps? Thanks