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70/30 Racing
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11,372 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
okay guys, i am finally going to do it, im a gonna go turbo, NA is just pissing me off. so here's my question to all you turbo gurus out there:

are the exh manifolds from the BB DET and the GTiR interchangeable, as in can the T28 from the GTiR fit on the BB manifold and vice versa? also, can you mount a T28 on the NISMO manifold? i know that there are better setups out there, F-Max, etc, but i really dont trust myself with that kind of power, plus i dont trust our trannies with that kind of power, i just want a nice, quick daily driven car capable of low 14s high 13s on street tires. plus, i dont really want to spend over $3500 on a turbo setup for a car worth $13K. i already have a JWT ECU, motor mounts, 97 tranny with VLSD, full suspension, brakes, ACT clutch, and all bolt ons, incl cams, so all i would really need is the turbo hardware (370s, turbo and manifold, lines, IC and piping, exh components, etc) and my ecu to be reprogrammed ($100 IIRC) i also dont want to buy a DET as i feel my motor is in perfect condition, and i dont want to install something i am iffy about (maintenance wise) and this would only complicate things with my relatively low power goals (~200-220HP @ crank)

i also dont feel safe drilling holes in my engine block, so couldnt you just buy another lower oil pan and have a bung with the proper fitting welded onto it for the oil return line?

as for the turbo, what is a good price on a good condition or rebuilt T28? and what trim should i get, i am not too worried about lag, i mainly just dont want the turbo to fall on its face past 6K rpm.

last one:

i have the tomei 256 (IIRC) cams, so would i need to play with cam timing to prevent reversion? would this pose enough of a problem at say 8-10 PSI and keeping it below 7K rpm?

thanks fellas (and ladies, if there are any)
 

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596 Posts
Well, I can help you with one question. The Manifolds are not interchangeable. The T28 will not fit onto the Bb exhaust manifold and vice versa. The T28 will work with the Nismo maifold.

I don't know if anybody has tried to modify their oil pan for the oil lines, but the SR20 block actually seems to have a boss specifically for the oil lines. Check out this url to see what I mean...http://www.brazosport.cc.tx.us/~lshadoff/turbo/drill.html

As for the ECU, I hope you are correct about the $100 reprogram from JWT. I have a JWT ECU, and I also plan to get a T28 turbo for my SR20DE.

Hope this helps. Sorry I couldn't help you with all your questions.

Tommy
 

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sleeper
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5,445 Posts
Since the sr20 was designed as a turbo motor, it already has a location to drain the oil back to the block, i.e. the boss.

The t28 will not bolt up to the BB manifold because the turbo will hit the block. The GTi-R manifold pushes the t28 out farther so it doesn't hit the block. When I had my t25/BB manifold off my car, my friend and I tried to test fit his GTi-R/t28 on my car. It fit, if the radiator fans weren't on. You'd either have to get some really thin fans or some pusher fans. That's about the only complication I could see with the t28.

If all you're looking for is low 14's, high 13's, the t25 will get you there, especially since you already have cams. I haven't had the chance to push my car hard yet so I can't tell you if it falls off or not at 6k. From what i've read, crank the boost to 10 psi and it won't fall off. As for your cams, you MIGHT have to get cam gears. I guess find out the specs on the cams (overlap, duration, all that stuff) and give JWT a call.

Khiem
 

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70/30 Racing
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11,372 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
yeah, i know about the boss on the block, however, i feel uneasy about drilling into the block as this *may* introduce metal particles into my oiling system, and i know you can take off the oil pans, but this is also extra work, that frankly, i dont want to do. i also want to easily be able to collect on my warranty for my car in case i blow it up and you cannot repair a hole drilled in the block, but you can change an oil pan. i just feel uneasy drilling into the block even if it that location is for an oil return line.

thanks for the info about the nismo manifold, that is probably what i will get, i think it is $160 from courtesy nissan IIRC and the downpipe elbow is $60 IIRC.
 

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sleeper
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5,445 Posts
Well, I did my turbo in steps.... drilling and tapping the block is a pain, buy you only have to do it once. The hardest part is taking the pans off. And then, you want to make sure they seal correctly after you reinstall them.... Would suck to have them leak and have to take them off again.

As for the hole, I put a threaded plug in it. I drove it that way for like 3 months until I put the turbo on.

As for draining the oil back to the drain pan... well, there are two possible problems I can see with that. It would place the drain line in a low and relatively unprotected position so if you run over something, you could knock it off.

The other problem is I recall reading that the oil has to be able to drain very easily. The location of the stock boss lets the oil practically fall back into the motor. If the oil can't drain freely, it could stay up in the turbo and cause problems or something like that. I don't see this as being a major prob though, just a consideration. I guess see if you find out if anyone drains their oil into a location other than the stock one.
 

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70/30 Racing
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11,372 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
ohh, okay, i think i will do it the hard way then :p

well, if anything it will be for peace of mind...

what setup are you running? opinion? costs?

thanks man!
 

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sleeper
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5,445 Posts
running the t25, bb mani(extrude honed and swain coated), greddy exhaust right now, JWT S3 cams and cam gears, JWT ECU, 370cc injectors, workin on a front mount. Oh yeah, this is all on my sr20de motor.

There's a lot of little small things involved when you install this stuff. The absolute biggest pain in the ass is getting the manifold and turbo on because the A/C line is in the way. Be very careful as the second time I took off the manifold, I accidently broke my A/C compressor. So that is going to put me out abou $400. Expensive mistake huh?

I also had an oiling problem.... long story, I fried two turbos. that a WHOLE lot of money... Needless to say, I'm a broke mofo! When you start working on your project, you can drop me a line and i can help you out. It'd take a long time to explain all the small things you need to do but hopefully you won't repeat my mistakes!

Concerning the extude honing and coating, those aren't cheap! Reason I did them though was because I'm looking for crazy mad hp either. Just a nice bump. So I'm not planning on ever upgrading. I'm also kinda scared of breaking the tranny. I plan on doing as many track events and auto-x's as I can too so even more reason not to go crazy on the HP (unless you like switching out trannies).

This is all on my '96 by the way.....
 

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70/30 Racing
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11,372 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
hmm...cool setup, any idea what youre running in the 1/4?

what I/C are you using, i was thinking of going ghetto for now and using a stock BB I/C, and mounting it somewhere creative, like maybe the fender well or something like that...

i am gonna have biggie and tom @ SR20DEvelopment help me out on the install, something they have done about 1.3 billion time, so i shouldnt run into too many install problems.

can a T25 mount up to the nismo manifold? do you know if there are clearance issues with a T28 and nismo manifold or is this the same as the GTiR manifold?

minus the ECU, how much do you think the total on all the turbo hardware would be, as in turbo, manifold, IC & piping, oil/water lines, injectors, and downpipe? i already have a place that can fab me up some 3" for about $400, with a straight through muffler and resonator, mandrel.

thanks again, and i will probably have more questions, and brain picking to do.
 

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sleeper
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Hmm.... I've seen guys selling the turbos and manifld for $400-$500. A turbo rebuild will cost around $400. Four brand new injectors ~$400. Water lines are cheap.... oil lines and fittings are another story. I think all my oil line and fittings stuff came to ~$75. I got my downpipe from chris at sr20dev. for I think ~250. Count on a new FMIC and piping and hose couplings costing at least $800. Guages will cost you between ~$100-$500 depending on what you get and how many. Turbo timer is another $100. A electronic boost controller is another ~$300(can't really remember). Cams gears are ~$140. And then you'll need a new exhaust manifold gasket $15, other small things like teflon tape, anti-seize, etc. Oh yeah, new sparkplugs (which need to be gapped). etc, etc, lots of little things.

Khiem
 

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www.motorists.org
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3,047 Posts
Ok, here's the info. I did exactly what you did on my 98 motor for almost a year til I decided to grab a wrecked NX for $700 and sell my Sentra and the turbo parts to go to a bigger turbo setup with the NX.

I have the exact drill and tap you need for your block. You can borrow them from me if you want. Did it myself with the oil pans off. Just be slow and careful and you should be ok.

For the oil feed line and both water lines I hacked the stock DET banjo fittings off and just used fuel line from Pep Boys. I didn't know how to form my own custom lengths of braided steel lines so I did it this way. Just make sure you double clamp those mofos. Had my oil feed line pop off once. ;)

AC is a PITA with this turbo and manifold. Make sure you take off the exhaust elbow when you put it on the car. I was not able to get the mani+turbo on the car with it attached. It's a PITA to get to the bolts to put the elbow back on, but I was not able to do it a different way.

370cc injector install is pretty straightforward. Make sure you get new o-rings. I've been told you are supposed to change them everytime you get injectors. They are really cheap too so there's no reason for you not to get them.

I homemade my own IC piping from mandrel J-bends ordered from Hooker Headers from Summit Racing. For a T25 use 2" pipe. I front mounted the stock small BB TMIC on the front of the car.

Since you already have the JWT ECU you should be able to complete this project for just under $1000. I ran a best of a [email protected] with the stock 7psi of boost with open exhaust and street tires. So 13's are not a problem with this setup.

I really don't see why one would spend around $2k for a full bolt on NA setup for like 155hp when you could do this T25 setup and have 200hp for less money.

If you don't already have a JWT ECU, make the price right around $1500.
 

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70/30 Racing
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11,372 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
cool, thanks for all your help guys, you are making the transformation from dream to reality an easy one for me on this little project. i am not planning to go much past 10 psi, so should the BB T25 be able to easily undertake my task here? and would the stock motor be able to take this from a T25? i know these turbos, due to their small size, create a fair amount of heat and backpressure at higher boost levels, but would this still be in the T25's optimum operating range?

I really don't see why one would spend around $2k for a full bolt on NA setup for like 155hp when you could do this T25 setup and have 200hp for less money.
hey! *NOW* he tells me, gawd!

actually it was more like $1200 (i seem to come across the best of deals) and i got pretty close to 155 whp, but that isnt enough, and is still a rip off compared to turbo.

oh, and the whole reason for me wanting this setup is that i wanna be able to run with the big boys on street tires, ie mustang cobras, Z28s, etc...these cars have always been a 1/4 performance marque for me(esp the new new cobras and just about any 94+ Z28 (SS) ), and i do not enjoy running high 14s @ 92 mph next to the mid-high 13s @ 100+ mph these boys are running. i wanna make them eat their smiles by being next to them the whole track, all in good fun of course! (that and a buddie's S4 that i want to eat SE-R turbo exhaust)
 

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Off-Topic lurker..
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why not just buy a low miles, complete SR20DET for $1700?

mail me if interested...
 

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70/30 Racing
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11,372 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
more complicated job than i want to undertake, besides, i can order them from SR20DEvelopment, i have known chris "Biggie" Parker for about 5 years, and he lives within 4 miles of me.

my motor is in excellent condition, synthetic since 1K miles, and every 3K after that. if i pop this motor, then i would, naturally get the BB motor, but until then, i think i will save my $700+shipping+install time until later.

thanks though! that is a very good price for a BB DET though.
 
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