[TRUSE-R]

Well, I purchased a set of JWT S3 cams & did the install as per the instructions. I had the car @ TDC: 2nd mark from the left on the crank pulley, cam lobes (on # 1) facing away from eachother, intake cam dowel pin @ 10 o'clock & exhaust cam dowel pin @ 12 o'clock. I zip-tie the sprockets to the chain and put a block to jam the chain. I install the cams (20 pins dot to dot or 21 links) and tried to set the timing to 15 degrees. When I try to do that, I would almost have to fully advance the distributor (It should be in the middle)? Well, I tried to drive the car, I felt slower and weaker & hesitated once and a while. After break-in, I tried to race my cousins Integra & I lost.....I usually beat him pretty far! Anyway, I double check everything and I am confused by the whole situation. Anyway, my friend (who is a mechanic) & I tried to reinstall the cams.....same result? Then he thought that would should jump it by one pin....so we did. Everything @ TDC (intake @ 10 & exhaust @ 12, 2nd mark from the left on the crank pulley & the cam lobes facing away from eachother), we move the exhaust by one pin from 20 to 21 pins. I go to set the timing and what do you know, I go it to 15 degrees with the distributor in the middle! My friend & I are baffled by this. Well, my first impression is that the car feels stronger (SOTP) and it doesn't stall! Well, I have 40 miles on them and will wait to after they are broken in before I race my cousins Integra. Well, Any and all info & advice will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
KEN ABAT
P.S.
Thanks to Mike Kojima for all the HELP

 

[TRUSE-R]

Well, I purchased a set of JWT S3 cams & did the install as per the instructions. I had the car @ TDC: 2nd mark from the left on the crank pulley, cam lobes (on # 1) facing away from eachother, intake cam dowel pin @ 10 o'clock & exhaust cam dowel pin @ 12 o'clock. I zip-tie the sprockets to the chain and put a block to jam the chain. I install the cams (20 pins dot to dot or 21 links) and tried to set the timing to 15 degrees. When I try to do that, I would almost have to fully advance the distributor (It should be in the middle)? Well, I tried to drive the car, I felt slower and weaker & hesitated once and a while. After break-in, I tried to race my cousins Integra & I lost.....I usually beat him pretty far! Anyway, I double check everything and I am confused by the whole situation. Anyway, my friend (who is a mechanic) & I tried to reinstall the cams.....same result? Then he thought that would should jump it by one pin....so we did. Everything @ TDC (intake @ 10 & exhaust @ 12, 2nd mark from the left on the crank pulley & the cam lobes facing away from eachother), we move the exhaust by one pin from 20 to 21 pins. I go to set the timing and what do you know, I go it to 15 degrees with the distributor in the middle! My friend & I are baffled by this. Well, my first impression is that the car feels stronger (SOTP) and it doesn't stall! Well, I have 40 miles on them and will wait to after they are broken in before I race my cousins Integra. Well, Any and all info & advice will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
KEN ABAT
P.S.
Thanks to Mike Kojima for all the HELP

 

[jomama]

this might be a little hard to believe given all the measures you took to prevent it, but you may have skipped a tooth (or two) during the install. i'm not sure how hard it was for you to "unbolt" the cam - when i did the '91 intake cam on my car, i apparently jerked it hard enough to make it skip at least 2 teeth even with the zip ties. when i put the car back together, it ran like sh*t at first and then i couldn't set the timing properly after that. i took the valve cover off and adjusted it just as you had and it was fine. i strongly encourage using whiteout to mark where the chain and sprockets align, that way, if you skip a tooth unknowingly, it'll be pretty visually apparent.

 

[eric96ser]

Put the motor at TDC, and take a picture of the cam gears.

 

[TRUSE-R]

Thanks for the info, but why is my car running well on 21 pins instead of 20?

 

[TRUSE-R]

Put the motor at TDC, and take a picture of the cam gears.

It looks exactly like the pic from the JWT instructions except for the number of pins

 

[jomama]

hmmm...i misread that part of our post. if you only moved the exhaust cam by 1 pin, then i don't think you have your timing properly set. the timing is based off the exhaust cam shaft. so this could be a likely scenario of what happened:

- you skipped a tooth on both the intake and exhaust cam when removing the shaft
- you install the new shafts 1 tooth off, intake and exhaust
- your car runs like crap and the timing is way off
- you move the exhaust shaft over one pin, fix half the problem and the car now runs fine, and times ok b/c relative to the exhaust cam, you're at 15 degrees; but relative to the intake cam, you're probably still several degrees off

it is POSSIBLE that if you moved the intake cam one pin closer to the exhaust cam, your car would be properly set up. i'm not sure about this, so please confer with others on the board before doing so.

 

[AZ WHITE SE-R]

If i were you i would put the car back to tdc with the cam lobes on cylinder 1 opposing eachother. take the chain off of the sprockets and put it back on properly. to do this pull up all of the slack in the chain on the exhaust side and place the chain back on to the sprocket so that the lobe is pointing directly out and away from the other one and so that the dowl pin is exaclty at 10 o'clock. then count over 20 pins, not 21 even if it seems to run ok like that, and place the chain on the sprocket on the intake cam. if you get all the slack out of the chain when you pull it up on the exhaust side, the intake lobe on the intake cam should be exactly opposing the exhaust cam and the dowl pin should be dead on 12 o'clock. it is pretty important that you have the cams timed properly because teh sr20 is an interferance motor, which meand that the valves and pistons can come in contact with eachother if the cama are not timed properly. i am not sure how far off the timing has to be on them for this to happen, but every tooth you are off on a cam sprocket is a 10 degree change. i know that you will not have any interferance problems if you are just off by one tooth, but i would want to make sure that everything is installed properly before you go driving too hard on it.

 

[eric96ser]

We don't need 2 threads with the same info. I'm combining the two.

 

[TRUSE-R]

Jomama & AZ thanks for the info. I will probably try to move the intake cam one pin over (closer to the exhaust cam) so I will have 20 pins. Currently (with 21 pin config) the car is set to 15 degrees and when I rev the car the intake tone sounds louder than ususal (is that normal). I believe that my friend & I tried moving the intake over one pin and he stated that the exhaust tone got noticably louder, he stated that this is a sign that the engine is running too advanced (we did not check the timing with a gun). I will try this once more and shoot it with a timing gun! Any and all info/advice/suggestions is greatly appreciated.

THanks,
KEN

 

[jacen99SE]

Check compression also in the different configurations

 

[TRUSE-R]

I am going to try what "AZ" stated. I will put everything to TDC and try to pull up the slack on the exhaust cam. I will count 20 pins over and place that on the intake cam. I hope this will correct my problem Thanks for all the info guys.

KEN

 

[totaled200ser]

ok here is what i did to fix this problem, put #1 cyllinder on tdc set exhaust cam to around 12 o'clock, pull all slack from exhaust side. unbolt the intake cam sproket, now count 20 links to the timing mark on the intake cam gear, put chain on sproket with dot 20 links apart, rotate intake cam so that the dowel pin lines up with the notch on the cam gear, install cam gear on cam and torque to spec. now install tensioner and set timing. i hope this helps you out some.
drew

 

[TRUSE-R]

Drew,

Thanks for the info... I will do as you stated tomorrow. I wish I had a couple of days off from work to finally fix my car Let you guys know how it turns out

Late,
KEN

 

[totaled200ser]

no prob man, here is what was wrong with my car....timing jumped on crank, intermittent bad maf that has now gone less intermittent, lol, and the gas had been sitting for a while so i had some condensation in it. this was the worst car i have ever had to diagnose. installing a stand alone was cake compared to this. hope that helped you out, now i gotta find a maf

 

[TRUSE-R]

Drew,
I just tried out what you did.....However, my car sounded weird and it seems to have run slower This is what I did. I put the car to TDC. I released the tensioner and made sure that the chain on the exhaust side was tensed. I put the chain on the exhaust cam sprocket and counted over 20 pins & placed the chain on the intake cam sprocket. The car ran weird. Do I have to drive it around a bit & break it in? I am to the point where I may put the stock cams back in! I was so frustrated that I did not even check the timing on the car! I will take a look @ it tomorrow.....Need a miracle
Late,
KEN

 

[AZ WHITE SE-R]

Drew,
I just tried out what you did.....However, my car sounded weird and it seems to have run slower This is what I did. I put the car to TDC. I released the tensioner and made sure that the chain on the exhaust side was tensed. I put the chain on the exhaust cam sprocket and counted over 20 pins & placed the chain on the intake cam sprocket. The car ran weird. Do I have to drive it around a bit & break it in? I am to the point where I may put the stock cams back in! I was so frustrated that I did not even check the timing on the car! I will take a look @ it tomorrow.....Need a miracle
Late,
KEN

The timing could be the problem here, if you are sure that the cams are installed correctly (being that they are in the correct position).

 

[TRUSE-R]

The timing could be the problem here, if you are sure that the cams are installed correctly (being that they are in the correct position).

What exactly do you mean?

KEN

 

[totaled200ser]

here is one thing you may be doing wrong, count the links, not the pins, i bet you have 21. try it with what looks like 19 pins, crank it by hand a few times. aslo, did you reset the dist. back to the middle where it should be or is it all the way advanced?

 

[TRUSE-R]

here is one thing you may be doing wrong, count the links, not the pins, i bet you have 21. try it with what looks like 19 pins, crank it by hand a few times. aslo, did you reset the dist. back to the middle where it should be or is it all the way advanced?

Isn't it supposed to be 21 links (2 pins within a link, correct) & 20 pins? People have stated to count the pins (20) and not the links 21 as shown on the JWT instructions. Currently I have it with 21 pins! When you say to try it @ 19 pins...so I move the intake or exhaust cam???? The distributor is in the middle! You guys have been a great help.... All info is greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
KEN