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VE powered
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I had someone drive my car during fun runs at yesterday's event. I drive like a grandma in the slaloms compared to this guy. When it came to my turn at the wheel I made certain to go thru the slaloms faster than I dared. Wow! He said I picked up 5-7 mph on the big slalom (six cones, 30 paces).

Anyhow, he tells me afterwards that nearly all the big names (Ron Bauer, Joe Goeke, Glen Hernandez) in our region left foot brake in the slaloms (and elsewhere). Basically, they floor the throttle and modulate their speed with the brake at the turn in of each cone. Supposedly, this technique not only keeps the revs up but keeps the back end in line.

Does anyone here left foot brake? I think Larry does. What about Pat and George?

Steve
 

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that **** sounds hard, man..

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Aztec Red 1993 NX2000
 

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I used to left-foot brake, but I found I used the brakes too much. I would tap the brakes to try and get the car to rotate when all I really needed to do was lift.

I think you'll find that there are just as many "top" autocrossers who DON'T left-foot brake as there are who do.

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'93 Sentra SE-R, daily driver and track/autox toy
'91 Sentra SE-R, future racecar
 

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employment whiplash, NC
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I left foot brake, but not like that. I use it to have a smoother, quicker transition from gas to brake and back to gas.

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Matt
92 SE-R from Heck

"What have you DONE to that thing..." - stranger at Rockingham dragway 5/18/01
"Where's the turbo?" - stranger at the 1st autocross of 2000 where my SE-R debuted
"That thing is a goddamn rocket ship. I'm not lifting for you on the straights anymore!" -Karl Shultz, Rockingham 4/27/01
"What in the hell have you done since I drove it last?" -David Stone, Rockingham 4/27/01
 

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by MaddMatt:
I left foot brake, but not like that. I use it to have a smoother, quicker transition from gas to brake and back to gas.

</font>
I'm not smart enough for that stuff. If my left foot is near the brake, I use it too much.


Another reason I don't like to left-foot brake is because with the foot resting on the brakes, it sometimes causes a vacuum problem -- you go to hit the brakes, and the pedal won't go down!

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'93 Sentra SE-R, daily driver and track/autox toy
'91 Sentra SE-R, future racecar
 

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I've heard both sides of this debate a few times.. Left foot braking can theoretically enable you to control the car better and smoother than right foot braking. BUT, it is also really damn hard and you WILL be slower as you learn how to do it. If I was gonna learn how to LFB, I'd buy one of those new M3s with the sequential tranny and paddle shifters so I didn't have to worry about a clutch




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Paul
'92 NX2000 w/ mods
 

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if I did that, I would not go anywhere.

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98 se-r w/ p/r cai,jwt s3 cams, stillen header, courtesy exhaust, ur pullies, JUN flywheel, ACT clutch, eibach springs, kyb struts, st sways, cusco camber plates, f/r strut braces,stillen lower control arm brace,SMC BAKB, motul 600 brake fluid, lotsa bushings, and a bunch of other crap
 

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by autoxer7:
Anyhow, he tells me afterwards that nearly all the big names (Ron Bauer, Joe Goeke, Glen Hernandez) in our region left foot brake in the slaloms (and elsewhere). Basically, they floor the throttle and modulate their speed with the brake at the turn in of each cone.
</font>
Actually, I'd bet in slolams, they're not using any brakes. Once you take the evolution school you'll learn that the best way to drive a FWD car through a slalom is to accelerate through it. The timing of the wheel is everything as you need to turn in fast enough to try and run over each cone. What you're doing is turning in, sliding the car a few feet and it catches just past the cone.

You stay on the gas to better balance the weight of the car.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
Does anyone here left foot brake? I think Larry does.</font>
Yes I do LFB. However it's something that took me a while to figure out. I started practicing on the street in my wife's automatic Civic before I started doing it in competition.

I think it helps me most in places where a tap of the brakes are required. If you can tap then be able to get back to the throttle immediately, you will be faster. I've seen the GEEZ data for RFBer's and there is a coasting lag between gas and brake. I eliminate this by LFB.

However, you must be smooth on the inputs or you'll be slower. So if you can't be smooth with your left foot, then don't try it. It'll just frustrate you.

-LM
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Thanks for the reply, Larry. Good luck at Nationals! And don't forget to kick Chiles' ass... both of them.


Steve
 
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Yeah, I LFB in my automatic Outback wagon when I think I'm going for a clutch.. ):O Don't drive it much.
 

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i, personally am of the non-LFB camp.. i dont really see the point personally.. the time you "save" by LFB'ing could easily be made up by concentrating on your line, plus car setup can go a long way


i have found a decent setup for my car to be:
front shocks 2, PSI 44
rear shocks 5, PSI 40

btw.. the fastest way through a slolam is with slight understeer
unless of course it is a decreasing slolam.. those are hairy



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Shawn
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current car(s):
1989 Acura Integra LS
1997 200SX SE-R
1973 Super Beetle

Next car:
AE86 Corolla GT-S
 

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by shadowboy:
i, personally am of the non-LFB camp.. i dont really see the point personally.. the time you "save" by LFB'ing could easily be made up by concentrating on your line, plus car setup can go a long way


i have found a decent setup for my car to be:
front shocks 2, PSI 44
rear shocks 5, PSI 40

btw.. the fastest way through a slolam is with slight understeer
unless of course it is a decreasing slolam.. those are hairy



</font>
by my car, i mean the integra.. the 200SX and the beetle are merely shared cars


and this was meant to be an edit, not a reply.. guess its too early in the morn to click the right button

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Shawn
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current car(s):
1989 Acura Integra LS
1997 200SX SE-R
1973 Super Beetle

Next car:
AE86 Corolla GT-S

[This message has been edited by shadowboy (edited 09-07-2001).]
 

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I sit too close to the wheel to LFB. Larry's right, the fastest way through a slalom is to keep on the gas. If you get on and off the gas, it upsets the car. Keep it at part throttle, not WOT, all the way through. I used to stab the throttle, but then a friend, who has been through the Evolution school, was working a slalom at a National Tour and he told me to keep on the gas the entire way through. It made a big difference.
 

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by shadowboy:
i, personally am of the non-LFB camp.. i dont really see the point personally.. the time you "save" by LFB'ing could easily be made up by concentrating on your line, plus car setup can go a long way

</font>
Once the car is setup, and you've developed the skills to follow a line the way you walked it, LFBing becomes another skill that can make you faster. It doesn't slow you down unless you're not comfortable with it.

I've reached the point now where I *can't* right foot brake. It's too awkward for me now. But that's me, and everyone is different. So YMMV.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
i have found a decent setup for my car to be:
front shocks 2, PSI 44
rear shocks 5, PSI 40
</font>
With what tires on what surface? And is this for a stock class car?

In my ES car on Kumhos/Concrete I run 51psi F and 29psi rear. I set my KYB AGX's to 2 in the front, 8 in the rear.

Oh, and I run an ST front sway bar.
 

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">In my ES car on Kumhos/Concrete I run 51psi F and 29psi rear. I set my KYB AGX's to 2 in the front, 8 in the rear.

Oh, and I run an ST front sway bar.
</font>
You run 51psi in the front??? Damn, I might have to try that.
 

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by eric96ser:
You run 51psi in the front??? Damn, I might have to try that.</font>
Yup. They like lots of pressure in the front tires on FWD.
If I were running Hoosiers, I'd probably be up near 60psi in the fronts like Mark Chiles does.
-LM
 

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Originally posted by SERCA96:
Once the car is setup, and you've developed the skills to follow a line the way you walked it, LFBing becomes another skill that can make you faster. It doesn't slow you down unless you're not comfortable with it.

I've reached the point now where I *can't* right foot brake. It's too awkward for me now. But that's me, and everyone is different. So YMMV.

I'd venture a reply here too and say that practice left footing on the street in an automatic car..go to a praking lot and see if you can attack and hit braking points ie., spots or lines while left foot braking. Left footing is all about speed from gas to brake and visa versa. BUT you have to hit your braking spots. Left footing also helps you trail brake into corners, something SE-Rs as a rule need, especially B14s.

Left footing is not as important as braking in general..knowing when, where and how hard to brake will make you so much faster in autocrossing. Ride with some national level guys once, if and when we brake
its NOW and its over, don't drag the brakes brakes tip toe on the pedal or rest your left foot there..use them and be done with it.

To add to Larry's slalom technique too, remember to be quick with the wheel. Slaloms need a quick spring-shock-suspension compression so a quick wheel movement is necessary. Slow smooth slalom runs are never the fast way. You almost have to get mad at slaloms attack them with the wheel and remember to keep your eyes up to see if you are running out of room before that last cone or if the cones are various lengths apart.

Hope this helps.

gpser96
 

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I personally practice LFB all the time on the street... when im about to take a turn... ill heel to downshift into the gear i want (i.e. 2nd) and then use my left foot to slow the car before the turn... if i do it right ill get right back on the gas and still be in the right gear so i can accelerate out and transfer some weight to the rear.... I wonder if this will help me when i try to get my license next Wednesday?
 

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I'm definitly part of the LFB crowd. I can't drive without it now!! But there are a few key points that make it work for me and why I use it. 1st I have a race seat and 6pt belts so I don't move at all and don't have to hold myself in place with the steering wheel. 2nd it's not an every corner thing, just the corners that you need *this much* more rotation but if you set the car up that way it wouldn't be as good the rest of the corners. It really comes down to personal style and preference.

Blair
76 DSP
91 NX2k
 
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